Norwich City v Stoke (away) 13th January 2016

[It's Character Forming]

Idiotic by O'Neill and it cost us the game and probably a point.

But this midweek brings us far more positives overall with results elsewhere and a  great effort from the team,  Vadis with his best performance so far, Jarvis back,  brady again solid on the left and a manager who will try and seize an opportunity.  And what a goal.  Rudd did well to keep us in the game with  some good saves.

Negatives?  I remain far from convinced by mbokani,  first half especially was poor with limited mobility,  improved in the second half but not great. And some fans over reaction.     As bad as O'Neills tackle was the abuse he got was appalling,  the comments of never playing for the side again totally disproportionate.   Criticism of the manager for the subs??   Tactically it had merit but ultimately it neither worked but more importantly did not cost us the game either - weak defending did.  And criticising Rudd?  He was solid and had little chance with any of the goals; if we keep allowing him to face so many chances through lax defending he will eventually be beaten.

Move on, regroup,  focus on the positives,  recognise that stoke player wise are half a step up from ours (and more importantly bournemouths) and look to repeat last nights efforts on saturday.   Do that and we will bring something home.

And dont beleive the hype that this is a MUSTWIN game; its preferable but not essential,  a draw will be adequate.

I agree with most of this, the O'Neill sending off changed the game totally.  Until the sending off we were controlling things in midfield.  Both sides were getting a fair number of chances, Stoke mainly on the break and they found a lot of joy down both flanks, we were working the ball well and creating chances through the middle.  Wes had that chance when Butland fluffed his clearance, it went just wide of the open goal, and shortly after we should have scored from that point blank chance in the box, not sure who struck it.

Mbokani I thought did very well under very difficult circumstances.  Several times he had 3 Stoke players on him and still managed to come away with the ball.  Definitely justifying having the starting role at the moment IMO.

Rudd was excellent I thought, several very good saves, no way he could be criticised for any of the goals.  His kicking was solid too except that one moment when Wes was trying to get him to play it out to the left and he was caught in two minds and ended up putting it straight out.  Which is inexperience more than anything else - better for both of them just to keep it simple in that situation.

 

[ZLF]

Fair shouts ICF,  I recognise that I do seem to be the only one with a concern over Mbokani - most fans believed his performance was very good last night so can accept I am wrong and in the minority;  

My impression was of limited mobility, no goal threat & a lack of defending from the front.   At one stage Vadis burst through with only Mbokani in support,  M. stayed wide right but made no attempt to try and open a chance by dragging one of the three defenders facing VOO away.    His touch was poor and he was very easily dispossessed - it felt like every third touch was a "giveaway" of possession of the type that Wes is regularly criticised for - and not what we needed last night - his lay off for Redmonds shot was his only memorable positive contribution for me.   I just think we need more than someone looking for a physical battle.  

As I said I may be being over critical and alone in my thoughts;  at the moment I think his best performances have been as a sub - and that is how I would use him - so its probably good I am not the manager 

 

[Lavanche]

I personaly agree with you ZLF. His movement just isnt enough if we dont have the game in their half or have enough supporting players to use his hold up plays.

He is classic target man and in build up play his only trick is hold the ball and wait others.

So I would also use him in situations where we need a goal or have majority of posession.

When we were still with 11 man I cursed many times how he didnt close passing lanes or was late when we pressed, but after the red card his game improved a lot. I still think he had a decent game, but in my opinion Jerome should be starter as he can wear opponent down with his constant runs and take a part our build up plays. 

 

[eatonparkboy]

Fair shouts ICF,  I recognise that I do seem to be the only one with a concern over Mbokani - most fans believed his performance was very good last night so can accept I am wrong and in the minority;  

My impression was of limited mobility, no goal threat & a lack of defending from the front.   At one stage Vadis burst through with only Mbokani in support,  M. stayed wide right but made no attempt to try and open a chance by dragging one of the three defenders facing VOO away.    His touch was poor and he was very easily dispossessed - it felt like every third touch was a "giveaway" of possession of the type that Wes is regularly criticised for - and not what we needed last night - his lay off for Redmonds shot was his only memorable positive contribution for me.   I just think we need more than someone looking for a physical battle.  

As I said I may be being over critical and alone in my thoughts;  at the moment I think his best performances have been as a sub - and that is how I would use him - so its probably good I am not the manager 

You are not alone with your opinions of Mbokani. I put on last nights thread that I thought for the first half hour he was poor.

He stood waiting for the ball to come to him and the Stoke defenders were stepping in and clearing. He is a big lad and although short on immediate control and not the quickest he ought to be able to get to the ball first. That can make the players passing the ball to him look silly but it isn't their fault. His only real contribution was flicking on high balls which is pretty redundant if you are the last man.

Almost as soon as we went down to ten, he moved to the ball, used his body to screen it and then had the option of laying off or turning. And until he was substituted, I thought he did a lot better.

And I still refer to the lack of a leader(s) in the team. Nobody seems to complain if they get given a bad ball or continuously having to stop to collect. How about someone geeing up the players who aren't totally on their game. And Mbokani ought to be telling the players to give it to him where he prefers it.

I know he has lots of ground to cover as a lone striker but I don't really think it is his game. I still prefer a two man attack, little and large or whatever. And I still don't know why Hooper comes in for so much criticism when I believe his stats are the best of anyone at the club for scoring. And that says we desperately need a striker as the manager obviously doesn't agree.

I agree with you that Mbokani's best role is as a substitute. 

 

[Indy_Bones]

   I agree with you that Mbokani's best role is as a substitute. 

I think I'd argue that his best role is back at Kiev as he's simply not good enough for what we need IMHO.

I had concerns about the signing before it happened, and whilst there have been a couple of decent performances, I've seen nothing that suggests he's anywhere near good enough for this level on a consistent basis, and instead is a player that can score extremely well in weaker leagues but comes unstuck at the top level (which is what happened at Monaco and Wolfsburg, and is happening again here to some degree as well).

We desperately need a top striker during the window (along with a top CB as well),and instead of spending 8 mil on Naismith, we should be looking at 12mil plus on players like Austin and similar.

 

[Canaryboy]

I missed the game. Can somebody tell me what O'Neil did?

 

[dj161]

I missed the game. Can somebody tell me what O'Neil did?

2 footed slide tackle from behind on the halfway line with the ball already going out for a throw

 

[Lavanche]

I missed the game. Can somebody tell me what O'Neil did?

Two legged scissors tackle behind the opponent near sideline with ball going out from play so no  threat situation

 

[eatonparkboy]

I missed the game. Can somebody tell me what O'Neil did?

 

[Canaryboy]

That's ridiculous, uncharacteristic though so sure he'll be forgiven. Right in front of the gaffer too. 

That Howson strike was lovely though, a few more goals from him wouldn't go amiss this season.