Anybody Want The Keys?

[admin]

OK, so don’t panic. I’m not considering pressing ‘delete’. I am however considering my position as the ‘keyholder’ of NorwichTalk, and whether I am the right person to take this place forward.

I know that there are numerous web savvy people on this forum, some working in tech jobs, some business owners, and some pretty well known and well respected personalities, so I’m hoping that there is an individual or a group of multiple individuals who may be interested in taking the bull by the horns and having a go at injecting some fresh impetus into this place.

Let me just emphasise immediately that I am not looking for any payment, the proposed transfer fee is £0. Furthermore, it is really important to me that this place continues to exist as a forum for Norwich City fans, so any transfer of control would have the caveat or stipulation that I’d be offered the forum back for the same transfer fee should ownership change again within a certain period of time, or if the sites existence was threatened at any stage.

In other words, if Joe Bloggs takes this forum, and in 12 months time decides that they are bored. He has to offer it back to me, rather than press delete.

So, why am I offering this place out? Basically, I don’t think that I’m the right person to take it forward, for various reasons. One being that I’ve never fancied myself as a very good ‘community manager’.

Most importantly though, I think my heavy reluctance (or outright unwillingness) to put my name and face to the project is one of the things which has held this place back from growing. Furthermore, the more I post on the forum the less willing I have become to overcome my introversion and ‘come out’ publicly as the forum owner, something which I genuinely believe to be critical if it is to gain the trust of Norwich fans and become the thriving independent forum which everybody wants to see.

I’ve had a user suggest that I try and get a few minutes on Radio Norfolk, whilst I’d myself considered dishing out leaflets at an away game. Both would require me to waive my anonymity, so I’ve been considering whether to do that, or whether to pass this project on. 

A post on this forum yesterday went a long way towards convincing me that I certainly do not want to put my name and face out there. 

This place could be thriving if, for example, it was owned by a ‘Robin Sainty’ or a ‘Big Grant Holt’ or a 'Rick Waghorn', or indeed, anybody who simply has a personal twitter profile with #ncfc in their bio. Although I’m not stipulating this as a requirement, it would definitely help this place a lot. 

I’ve also got some serious time restraints. In between launching this forum and today, I’ve seen my business consume more and more of my time. In the early months this place was growing really quickly, and the slowdown in new memberships is largely due to the inactivity of both the facebook and twitter accounts. Somebody who was simply willing and able to post more regularly and interact more on social media would give this place a fighting chance of major success.

This place has a good foundation from which a thriving community could be built, any new owner would be inheriting a site and social media accounts with 340 members, 378 twitter followers, and 90+ facebook followers. Almost all of those members are opted in to the mailing list, and mass emails can be sent from the back engine.

Any new owners would be assuming the liability of the monthly hosting and software license cost, which is currently $30 per month (may be able to reduce that to $20 as it happens, on current traffic levels).  Ad earnings are currently covering that though, over £11 this month at the halfway point.  That fee includes all software updates and access to the softwares support forum. If the new ownership wanted to keep the advertising they would need to create a Google Adsense account. 

The domain name will also be passed on (currently hosted by GoDaddy, something like $10 a year renewal, about 18 months before it needs renewing). 

Any new owner does not need to be a technical genius (I can't write code by the way!) but should have experience using content management systems before, as Invision is a huge learning curve in the back end for somebody with no experience with websites. I’d be particularly interested in hearing from a group of multiple individuals who want to run the site together, with at least one being reasonably confident when dealing with tech stuff.

I don’t expect quick replies to this so will leave it up for your perusal and consideration. Happy to answer any questions (whether your interest is serious or not) on this thread or via PM. 

Cheers! 

 

[admin]

I should add that if a suitable party does come forward, the actual transfer would be unlikely to take place until January. I flog stuff for a living and Christmas is the busiest time of the year. 

I would of course always be on hand to offer any technical assistance e.g. tell you how to run a database backup. And if it all went t*ts up, I'd be here to take it over again.

 

[Andy]

I truly appreciate the time and effort that you have put in to create a decent forum for decent fans. I've also been impressed with the quality of posts on here and the sensible approach of the moderators. I must admit that I thought that the site would go the way of the others once the trolls moved in but it has been refreshing to see the vast majority of posters acting in a responsible way.

I know that you have been upset about some comments posted about you recently, and I thought that they were harsh, but if you take a step back and consider that this is one of the few places on the Internet where views from all sides of the Ched Evans debate have been debated without vitriolic personal abuse flying about, you should be proud that you have created a safe environment for this discussion to occur.

I'd be happy to be involved in some way to take this site forward although I don't really meet many of the qualities that you are looking for. I'm not a tecky person, although I do run a couple of websites with content management systems and so am not a complete novice. From day one I've put my personal details on here and do likewise on Twitter but am not a well known "personality". I run a couple of companies and so have some commercial experience and am a rookie lawyer so could help with the legal aspects.

I don't have a huge amount of time available (running the businesses together with being a trainee solicitor, parent of a disabled son and NCFC home & away season ticket holder can be quite time consumingI) and so couldn't do this alone. I would be happy to work with others or indeed not at all if there are others better placed to take the site over.

Anyway, there's one hat in the ring for you, hopefully there will be others.

 

[admin]

Thanks for the kind words and putting your name forward.

I'd like to think that I'm merely the first 'key holder' of something which will like on for many years, I don't like the word "owner" because it seems perverse to consider oneself he "owner" of a group of people, which is why I'd rather just think of myself as the current key holder. 

In fact, if a handover doesn't materialise I'd just carry on as normal until the time was right to try again. 

No great technical knowledge is required to run this place, it is already built. Just takes a while to get your head around the numerous options in the back end. Day to day management is actually really simple, the challenges come if you want to further develop the site, and upgrading to IP 4.0 would need somebody who knew what they were doing (the skin would need to be redesigned, hooks and apps reinstalled). 

But 3.4.7 is currently available which irons out current bugs so I'd run the upgrade for that before I handed it over, should fix the current issues with IE11. That version will continue to be supported for years, and it will be a while before 4.0 is stable and suitable anyway. 

And I'd be happy to help out with a 4.0 upgrade in the future, when that day comes, if the new key holders considered it necessary. 

I've been considering this for a while actually, it isn't a knee jerk reaction to feeling insulted last night. Time constraints and an unwillingness to end relative anonymity are the primary reasons. Although that thread did confirm my reasons for wanting to remain in obscurity as much as possible. I could really do without something writing something like "Joe Bloggs is a rape apologist" on a website which I have no control over, because I could do without Google making me unemployable.

So handing over the keys would give this place a fresh start and I'd actually take a lot of pleasure in seeing somebody or multiple people proving that this place is completely unreliant on one individuals continued interest (and like I said, if there is no solid interest, things will carry on as usual) and giving it the bit of time and energy it needs to grow further. 

Just having somebody who enjoys using social media would be a huge asset. New members come when the twitter and facebook accounts are active, and don't come when they aren't.

The fact that I don't even feel that I've got enough time to run a twitter account is reason enough for me to consider whether this place might be better off under somebody elses stewardship. It isn't a case of being desperate to get rid of the place, but rather an honest reflection and acknowledgement that I can't offer the time required to have a serious go at taking this place to the next level. 

 

[hogesar]

Well, I'm an IT Software Developer, covering from PHP to Objective-C for native Iphone Applications.

I'm interested - but need to have a think if in reality I have the time for it. Which is obviously a problem for you - I'm unsure if I'd be any better off.

Regardless, let me have a think to mull things over. I'll get back to you.

Thanks.

 

[Watling the Gnome]

It may be that "multiple people" is the way to go with this.  I would be happy to handle the Twitter account, for example, but couldn't commit to anything more.

Completely get the anonymity issue, I am not someone who seeks out the public eye either.

 

[admin]

Well, I'm an IT Software Developer, covering from PHP to Objective-C for native Iphone Applications.

I'm interested - but need to have a think if in reality I have the time for it. Which is obviously a problem for you - I'm unsure if I'd be any better off.

Regardless, let me have a think to mull things over. I'll get back to you.

Thanks.

It is of course possible to have multiple admins, with one being senior (can't be deleted by other admins). So please do also consider a scenario where you team up with others (such as Andy). 

I am not a developer at all (I cannot code. certainly cannot program, I can merely interpret code just about enough to tweak it, e.g. editing css stylesheets),in fact you are massively overqualified. When I say that "tech knowledge is required", I'm aiming that specifically at people who haven't, for example, even seen the back end of a wordpress site. Or have never heard of Cpanel and so wouldn't know how to run a database backup.

It would be irresponsible of me to hand over the site to somebody who didn't even think to backup everybodies posts every few weeks, just in case. 

That's the sort of technical ability I mean, not the ability to create the next facebook in a garage in Oakland.  If you were to be the person available for tech stuff (database backups, software upgrades / patches , installing or uninstalling hooks etc?),then you could always have somebody willing to run the social media pages? Remember that we already have two voluntary mods who I think have done a decent job, who people could ask to keep on, sure they would be happy to oblige (although can't speak for them).

My own time constraints relate more to constantly being uncertain of how much work I will have to do tomorrow, rather than how much I work per week, I run a small but growing eCommerce business from my attic. I have no idea whether I'm going to get 10 orders and 2 inquiries tomorrow or 40 orders and 20 inquiries tomorrow, whether I will be working 6am to midnight tomorrow, or grabbing the opportunity to have both a lay in and an early night. And more recently the very long days have been much more common than the lay ins, to the degree that I'm not far away from needing to employ somebody part time to help me out. 

I've even missed a couple of streams recently and forgotten to start match threads at appropriate times. I have to be realistic and acknowledge that the situation isn't going to improve much going forward, and whilst that is very good for me (it means I can pay the mortgage and buy some nice clobber),it isn't a good thing for this forum. 

 

[morty]

I can only realistically offer help on an ad-hoc basis really, mainly for work reasons too.

Of course I'd be more than happy to continue moderating.

 

[admin]

It may be that "multiple people" is the way to go with this.  I would be happy to handle the Twitter account, for example, but couldn't commit to anything more.

Completely get the anonymity issue, I am not someone who seeks out the public eye either.

The last time I used my real name on a website I attracted an insane stalker from Belfast who followed me around the internet for two years, he claimed to be in the UFF. 

 

[Dandy Mountfarto]

Websites, forums in particularly take time to build up a userbase, its something that will happen organically without you needing to do much promotion or give up anonymity. Norwich Talk is currently 4th on google for "Norwich City Forum", thats enough promotion to make sure any Norwich fans looking for a forum will find it.

You seem to know what makes a good forum, and how to set it apart from the Pink Un, which is not a good forum. I would be worried that if you hand it over to some self promoting superfan *bleep*you'll end up with the same petty squabbles as happen over there, and indeed, on a couple of threads here featuring the same people.

Imo someone who has no desire to be internet famous or tie their real life to their internet one is exactly the sort of person you want running it.

 

[morty]

Websites, forums in particularly take time to build up a userbase, its something that will happen organically without you needing to do much promotion or give up anonymity. Norwich Talk is currently 4th on google for "Norwich City Forum", thats enough promotion to make sure any Norwich fans looking for a forum will find it.

You seem to know what makes a good forum, and how to set it apart from the Pink Un, which is not a good forum. I would be worried that if you hand it over to some self promoting superfan *bleep*you'll end up with the same petty squabbles as happen over there, and indeed, on a couple of threads here featuring the same people.

Imo someone who has no desire to be internet famous or tie their real life to their internet one is exactly the sort of person you want running it.

All extremely good points!

 

[splutcho]

It is a great shame that you feel you no longer have the time. I don't really have the expertise to take it on, but I am quite happy to take over the social media side if needs be.

 

[Chris Brown]

I know i've not been around like I was at the beginning due to a few things irrelevant to this site, just taken a break from commenting online. But in terms of Facebook/Twitter other social media, I know I'm known for bad reasons originally around it, but I'd gladly be available for that, I think i'd be able to improve on it, and I feel i've matured myself in regards to the incident. Also i'm not a stranger to CMS's and building themes/imagery as well as HTML 5, CSS and PHP.

If you considered passing it over to a small group i'd gladly step up to the plate, but unfortunately not on my own.

 

[The Great Mass Debater]

I think it would be a crying shame if you handed the keys to someone else. This is your baby, and as one of the first people to sign up to it I appreciate what you have done. I know you have been upset by what has gone on, but try to remember what this place is first and foremost - a football forum which you created. I understand your feelings but it would be very sad for the forum if its creator had been driven out. 

Please reconsider

 

[hogesar]

As part of a group I have no problem helping with tech bits and bobs if that's what you need.

But this all points to the suggestion that maybe you should keep yourself in place and just offload some of the work to those that are willing to do it.

If @browno could push Social Media for example - that can make a massive marketing difference. I could probably take a look at what SEO could be done to the site - we could also look in detail at what best advertising revenues would ensure you're not splashing out any of your own cash on the site - if anything you should be making a few quid here and there if we can get the impression count up.

Feel free to PM me if you want to discuss any of my points further.

 

[Keckers]

I read the PinkUn for years without hardly ever contributing. You started this site and I found a home.

Delegation is surely the way to go? The site reflects your identity and input and someone else would want to put their own stamp on it which may diminish something that has been one of the naturist places to discuss all things football in years.

I missed the personal comments but surely that's a matter for moderation? I would genuinely urge you to reconsider. I don't want this site to change from the place where we can discuss things in a redeemable manner, where I feel free to unmask myself (I am a teacher in Norfolk and could easily become a target on other sites - this is the first time I have put myself out there).

 

[splutcho]

I would agree with the above posts too. It really would be a great shame if you weren't at least in some way involved. Any number of us are happy to take on social media, and frankly, what really needs doing on here at the moment? If you can take on one or two of the more tech minded people as an extra admin for when you're not around, we're laughing! Don't give something away you worked so hard on.

 

[Dandy Mountfarto]

something that has been one of the naturist places to discuss all things football in years.

Agreed, I too often post in the nude.

 

[admin]

Think I need to give it some further thought. 

Appreciate all the responses. I'm really tired at the moment and don't want to make a decision whilst not thinking with a clear mind. Even if I did want to transfer ownership, I wouldn't have the time to do that until January (like I said further up the thread). 

I've had an offer from somebody who would be more than qualified to take the forum, and who I trust would keep the thing alive. Likewise, there have been plenty of offers from people to manage the social media etc, and I should probably consider whether that would be the best way forward. 

I could have worked much smarter than I have, for example I can schedule the next 20 match threads and the system would post and pin them automatically. I'm really not sure why I haven't done that, and I'm going to schedule the next few this morning. 

 

[Lake District Canary]

Agreed, I too often post in the nude.

Hope the post box isn't too far from your house........

To admin - stick in there, its your baby and you are what makes this place tick.   Hang in there and watch the baby grow..............